Layer 8

Security is fundamentally about people, and everything we know about people is relevant to security. -- B. Schneier

Another fling with security semantics.

Jack Jones’s wonderful discussion of loss events started out by defining an incident even more narrowly than I have, and I think he’s on the right track. 

* How many of you have worked for an organization that suffered a security incident of some kind? (I have, and I suspect most if not all of you have experienced viruses/worms, system or data abuse and/or theft by employees, web defacements, etc.)

* In how many of these incidents was there the potential for significant loss/harm to the organization? (In my experience, many of the incidents have had the potential for significant harm.)

* How many of these incidents actually resulted in worst-case loss? (In my experience, none of them did – they didn’t even come close.)

I am all over Jack’s suggestion that we only count it as an incident if actual loss was incurred.  But hang on a tick—let’s define “loss,” too, and as something more tangible than just “productivity loss incurred because someone had to stop and pay attention to this event.”

Let’s try defining loss as a loss of confidentiality, availability and/or integrity that resulted in the loss of significant productivity or actual revenue.  If a virus blew up someone’s PC and he couldn’t get any work done until it was fixed, I’d call that an incident.  But if it just had spyware on it, and he had happily been working with it for months without anyone noticing or caring, then it’s not a loss, even if we had to stop him from working for an hour while we cleaned it up.  In this case, “significant” is whatever the management considers to be significant, and comes back to their decision on whether it’s worth pursuing or letting go.  One company’s significant loss is another company’s annoyance. 

This definition of “loss” gets tricky if you get into legal matters.  Say an employee mails himself company intellectual property that he ought not to have.  That’s a loss of confidentiality, all right, but has it caused any revenue loss?  Potential revenue loss, perhaps—but then you’d have to prove harm in a court of law if you decided to prosecute anyway.  If there’s a specific law broken by the loss of the C, I or A, then I guess you could consider that “harm,” but I’m getting on swampy ground and would need a lawyer’s help getting through that.  (Mark Rasch, where are you?)

By this definition, is every breach of company policy an “incident”?  Not by any means.  It starts looking more incident-like if a senior manager takes enough offense at the breach to want to take disciplinary action.  That can certainly cause a loss in (or at least diversion of) productivity to deal with.  But I think Jack might agree with me that choosing to enforce policies is the cost of having them, i.e. the cost of doing business.  When HR, Legal, Audit and Security take time to deal with the fallout of a breach, that’s what they’re there for; it’s a part of their job descriptions.  It’s not a loss in and of itself, caused by an adverse event. It’s an extension of our controls system designed to prevent actual losses.

This definition, if it were widely accepted, would help draw a better line between the “hey, I was just looking” sort of security breach that the original hackers were accused of, and the organized crime sort of breach that is intended to cause actual loss (and presumably gain for themselves).  Most laypeople never understood the difference anyway, since most of this activity takes place on a nonphysical, technical level that they can’t understand. 

This is also why the privacy angle is so murky these days, and it’s hard to prosecute companies for the exposure of individuals’ private information unless actual monetary losses occurred (in the form of fraud or identity theft).  Just because you feel someone Shouldn’t Be Looking doesn’t mean you’re incurring a loss.  But I’m not ready to give up on the privacy fight.  It’s just that I think we have a lot more to work out on the legal front.

Nevertheless, I think this new definition of “incident” will help us clear away a lot of cruft that has inflated our public statistics to the point where people don’t believe them any more.  And it gives me a new direction for my risk management discussions.  Thank you, Jack—and happy Fourth of July.

 

Posted by shrdlu on Wednesday, July 04, 2007
(6) CommentsPermalink blogmarks Favicon del.icio.us Favicon Digg Favicon Fark Favicon Furl Favicon Google Bookmarks Favicon StumbleUpon Favicon Technorati Favicon TailRank Favicon

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Comments

stacy Canada on 07/04  at  02:28 PM:

“Let’s try defining loss as a loss of confidentiality, availability and/or integrity that resulted in the loss of significant productivity or actual revenue.”

Sorry, that doesn’t float my boat.

Is the courier losing my backup tapes on the way to my off site storage an “incident”? You better believe it is. Did it cause me to lose “actual revenue”? I will probably never know. Do I claim that it cost me $2.5 billion? Only if I can figure out a way to claim that loss on my taxes grin

-stacy

shrdlu United States on 07/04  at  02:43 PM:

Did it cause me to lose “actual revenue”? I will probably never know.

Does “I will probably never know” translate to “it will probably never happen”?  If so, then what’s the problem?

</devil’s advocate>

stacy Canada on 07/04  at  03:31 PM:

Does “I will probably never know” translate to “it will probably never happen”? If so, then what’s the problem?

The problem is the word “probably”... we lack the ability to to assign a justified value to the probability; you think that value is close to zero while I think it is close to one (now who’s playing devil’s advocate? grin.

Also, there are times when having information on “near misses” is important. Did I avoid a loss because “our controls system designed to prevent actual losses” worked, or was I just lucky? I would like the opportunity to remove that dependency on luck, especial if I am losing backup tapes on a weekly basis.

I agree that there is a difference between an incident that cause a loss vs. one that only scare the crap out of you; but I consider them both subsets of “incident” not two different types of events.

-stacy

shrdlu United States on 07/05  at  07:47 PM:

Stacy, those are good points.  I wish Alex or Jack had time to jump into this discussion; I’m sure they’d have some better answers than I do.  The only thing I can throw out is that old chestnut, Luck is probability taken personally.  Do you really think it’s possible to remove all probability from the equation?  and if not, how much do you want to remove before you start feeling comfortable about not calling something an incident?

rybolov United States on 07/10  at  08:21 PM:

My rule of thumb is that if I have to spend more than 15 minutes dealing with whatever it is, then it needs to be added to my incident metrics.  But then again, I like to keep things simple. =)

JonesJ United States on 07/12  at  07:40 PM:

Shrdlu - Thanks for your kind comments about my loss event posting.  And I agree completely with your “expanded definition” of loss (didn’t mean to imply anything less in my post). 

Stacy - You raise an excellent point about the need to account for “near misses” and things that don’t directly (as far as we know) translate directly into loss.  For example, if someone accidently sends sensitive information via e-mail unencrypted over the Internet—should that qualify as a loss event?  We may never know if it was intercepted.  Here are a couple of things to consider:

1) “Material” loss from the perspective of the enterprise will, by definition, always be recognized - otherwise it wouldn’t qualify as material.  That isn’t to say something bad didn’t happen.  Someone may have captured that sensitive information and done something dastardly with it, but unless that’s tied back to the organization and loss to the organization results, then it isn’t a loss event from the perspective of the organization.  Before anyone skins me alive for that last comment… I believe it’s critical that we’re able to distinguish events where loss is realized by the organization versus those events where loss occurs to someone/something other than the organization.  We need to be mindful of the non-organizational loss events, but we can’t lump them together and maintain meaningful metrics.

2) There will be a lengthier post on this soon on riskanalys.is, but events like the e-mail scenario above can be described as “vulnerability events”.  Stated simply, a vulnerable condition has come into existence where it didn’t before.  This accounts for the fact that loss may occur in the future.  Again, I have a more fleshed-out explanation queued up for a blog post soon.

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